The Hankook Ventus V12 Evos. A TurboSloth Review.

"TurboSloth" (TheTurboSloth) 03/03/2014 at 10:23 • Filed to: None

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They're right, you know. You don't know what you have, until it's gone. I recently switched to some Kumho Ecsta ASXes after a brutal winter on summer tires. Immediately, you feel the difference. It's about 25 degrees outside, and I hear that summer tires stop working at around 45. Naturally, you'd think the Kumho tires, which are all season, would be better in colder weather. Wrong. There's a highway entrance by my house, which according to the speed limit sign, you should enter in at 20mph. Today, I entered in at 45mph, before feeling uneasy. In the Hankook's, I could have easily entered that banked curve at 80mph, without sliding.

The feeling you get when you switch off the tires is astounding. It's like any grip that was given to the vehicle has been taken away. It's like driving on a wet surface with these Kumho tires, which is bad, considering the surface was dry.

Unfortunately, as a college student, I only had 400 dollars (including tax) to spend on tires, which I needed (side wall was bubbling and about to burst on my old tires).

TL,DR: I miss my Ventuses.

Casper > TurboSloth 03/03/2014 at 10:28

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One thing people forget is that the temp ratings are usually for stationary tires. If the tire is sitting in x temp, the compound may harden... which is almost always accurate. The thing is, you put quite a lot of temp in tires driving around, so if you are someone who drives even somewhat aggressively or has a somewhat aggressive suspension setup, you probably put enough heat in the tires to get them working after a few miles. People in basic economy boxes are probably the only ones that wouldn't or people who spend their entire time in stop and go traffic.

Summer tires are the best in warm weather and rain, it's only ice and snow that are their weak points. If it's cold in winter, but not snowing or icy, the summer tires will probably still be better if they are up to temp.

SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman > TurboSloth 03/03/2014 at 10:29

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The V12 isn't a bad tire at all. I've driven competitively on them and sidewall squirm is quite evident only in that setting.

I rock the R-S3, myself. Supreme grip and likely the best streetable street tire available on market. I specified streetable street tire because the Hoosier A6/R6, Nitto NT01, BFG R1, etc, while being street tires are assininely stupid to be streeted.

SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman > Casper 03/03/2014 at 10:30

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But getting street tires up to temp is hard when it's cold..... Very hard

ColoradoTaco > TurboSloth 03/03/2014 at 10:31

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I had some v12 Evos on my S4 and the one time I had to drive in slush it was very unnerving. They were my Summer set but those May snowstorms can catch you off guard. I can't imgine the ASXs are any worse (coincidentally those are my new Summer set up)

crowmolly > TurboSloth 03/03/2014 at 10:31

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I did not care for my ASX's too much either. Didn't have a lot of grip in a 245/50. Replaced them with Conti DW tires and it was a big change. Granted it was all season to just 3, but still.

Casper > SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman 03/03/2014 at 10:32

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That depends on the vehicle, suspension setup, and driving style, and which tires they are.

DylanToback > TurboSloth 03/03/2014 at 10:32

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How long have you had them on the car? Every time I get new tires they typically don't feel right until they get some wear.

YSI-what can brown do for you > TurboSloth 03/03/2014 at 10:33

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I am probably getting the V12s because they are 300 dollars less than Pilot Super Sports, glad to hear they aren't a half bad tire.

willkinton247 > TurboSloth 03/03/2014 at 10:35

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My Kumho Ecsta 4X's have actually been really great in the slush and snow. I haven't had any serious problems this winter at all.

roflcopter > TurboSloth 03/03/2014 at 10:44

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Kumhos seem to be different in the cold than a lot of other tires, I've been running Ecsta SPTs on my car for the last 2 years or so and you can DEFINITELY tell when they're cold, but they behave just fine once you've put a few miles of heat in them. The Dunlops never seemed to have that problem but also never seemed to have the same kind of consistency once warm.

Stupidru > TurboSloth 03/03/2014 at 10:45

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V12s are a great budget summer tire. After a pretty bad winter on Kumho all-seasons, I decided to make the switch to dedicated summers and winters. The V12s were my first summer tire and a good one at that. Definitely not the best, but it offers a whole new level of summer performance than any AS tire will

efme > TurboSloth 03/03/2014 at 10:58

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i strongly disliked the ASXs when I had them 10 years ago. Why did you get asx's over the 4X? were there absolutely no other options?

I used to run only UHPAS and some were great some weren't that great. Eagle GT were my favorite and Conti DWS. Ziex912 and ASXs were the worst out of the 4.

SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman > Casper 03/03/2014 at 11:02

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Yea it does, but it doesn't detract from the fact that the cold makes it harder.

Casper > SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman 03/03/2014 at 11:08

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Yes, I don't think anyone said it didn't, but it many cars you actually have to fight over heating the tires. For instance, my commute will overheat a lot of tires because of the number of corners and vehicle setup. I put far more heat in them just driving a short stretch home than I do in autocross, so I have to pick my tires accordingly. As such, I have no problem running summer tires in winter unless it snows. Usually within the first mile or so my tires are at a temp they are working fine. Usually by the time I'm home they are steaming and plenty sticky.

If I suddenly had issues keeping heat I can always play with suspension alignments or tire pressure. It's rare that I would make a tire change simply due to temp.

SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman > Casper 03/03/2014 at 11:19

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Sounds like you're a dangerous driver, to me.

I autocross pretty competitively, and have done so on a National level and I very seldomly bash on my tires on the street enough to make them gooey optimally hot on the street.

Please don't do that Shit on the street. Keep it on the track.

Casper > SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman 03/03/2014 at 11:28

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Sounds like you are pretty ignorant to me.

30 minutes of standard high driving increases tire pressure by 50 degrees even without aggressive camber or toe on an average tire... in a straight line. Adding even mild camber and/or toe drastically increases this, and changing tire compound drastically changes heat soak rate and retention. Add a few corners and you don't have to be a "dangerous driver" to have soaked a significant amount of heat into your tires very quickly (over 120 degrees comes in the first few minutes on some commutes). That is why you are able to get so much heat in such a short time in autocross. Also, "gooey" isn't generally optimal for most street tires, they won't react like slicks to the heat, the compounds will usually grease before they really goo like a high perf compound unless it's a really hot day or you are playing with air pressure or something.

I actually worked with tire companies and had a lot of time with their engineering/R&D guys, raced semi-competitively (depending on season/time) in autocross, and race road courses/hill climbs, and race motorcycles. I also, as I'm sure you do, check my tire temp regularly with my infrared thermometers... but I actually check on normal drives as well.

SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman > Casper 03/03/2014 at 12:01

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Please excuse me as I take your advice with a grain of salt when you say you check tire temps with an IR thermometer, with you being in the know from engineers.

Any engineer in tire tech half worth their salt knows data from ir blasters is pretty meaningless because you aren't measuring at the tire cords , which is done with a probe pyrometer.

Yes, I do know, you are correct. I've worked on a pro race team and even though I'm not a tire engineer, I am an engineer nevertheless.

SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman > YSI-what can brown do for you 03/03/2014 at 12:02

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The PSS is worth every single penny of that extra 300 bucks. Don't compromise

Casper > SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman 03/03/2014 at 12:13

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You're the one who came in here and decided to blatantly violate rule #1, then spout bad information that would lead people to believe tires can't reach operating temp ranges from normal driving, only "dangerous" driving. Normally I have no issue with you, but normally you are also not being a dick without applying at least some logic to your argument.

I'm not looking to do an engineering analysis of the internal structure of the tire, simply to establish the heat absorption between travel points. I'm not going to very well probe my tires in a Walmart parking lot on a random trip to the store am I? I get enough weird looks leaning under and pointing a strange looking yellow thing at my tires as it is. If it were a race event in which we were looking for log data then it would be different, but this entire thread is not about the proper way to collect definitive core tire temperatures. So long as it's the same instrument, the accuracy is of minor concern to my objective.

It's no different than chalking tires for a trip. Sure, I could do some in depth analysis over my roll via other methods, but it's the simplest and most efficient way to do it without looking like a crazy Dilbert cartoon in a parking lot.

YSI-what can brown do for you > SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman 03/03/2014 at 12:41

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I will keep checking at Costco. They sell tires for around the price of tire rack but mounted and balanced. They also have 70
Dollar off coupons for a set of Michelin once in a while. Hopefully they carry these...

MouseFitzgerald > TurboSloth 03/03/2014 at 13:44

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I mounted these on my GTI in the fall and love the grip.

When you really push them you can feel the sidewall wiggle a bit but they're hard to break loose.

Excellent bang for the buck tire.

EDIT- I mean the Ventuses (or Ventusi?)

SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman > Casper 03/03/2014 at 14:44

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I'm typing this as I poop but I don't believe I was being a dick at all really...m argumentative, at best,but that's because I believed you knew your Shit and wanted a constructive debate.

I don t profess to be right all the time nor did I ever say anything that would lead people to believe tires don't get up to operating temps in the cold though. Go back and read my posts and show me where I was out of line.

I simply stated how your measurement method is not nearly as good as it can be. Maybe it's good enough, maybe not. I just know that I wouldn't trust data for temps acquired with an IR blaster, and neither would the tire engineer I just spoke to at lunch break.

Sorry if I offended you... I honestly didn t mean to.

Casper > SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman 03/03/2014 at 15:38

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It could be much better, but that isn't the point of the measurement. The sample isn't looking to acquire an exact temperature, but simply a difference. Even if the reading is inaccurate, so long as it's predictably inaccurate and it is being done with a reasonable sample size, it doesn't really matter for the use. I have a Longacre pyro probe as well, but again, that doesn't make much sense for this purpose.

The out of line part would be "sounds like you're a dangerous driver, to me" paired with a helping of "don't do that shit on the street". Since you didn't reference anything useful there is no real other way for it to be intended. You lacked any data to support your conclusion, and it was a purely emotional platform intended to antagonize.

All of the information I stated above is accurate. The napkin math is of 50 degrees per 30 minutes and such is all just standard references in the tire world as far as I know, and obviously adding friction increases the rate of heat accrual. I don't really know where it originated, but there are a lot of random articles and it's cited quite often... and works out in most testing unless the rolling resistance or material changes greatly.

http://www.caranddriver.com/columns/a-look…